As you know, this is a topic near and dear to me as well... I spoke with Owen Davis of NYC Seed a few weeks ago, and he seems determined to create a NYC startup incubator for the summer of 2010, which is awesome. If you haven't met him, I'd be happy to make an introduction.
I think the benefits to creating a vibrant startup community in NYC (like the one growing in DUMBO) are far reaching. To paraphrase Paul Graham, hackers will go where other hackers go. So creating a magnet for brilliant young talent is a great way to manufacture luck, which is the point of any incubator and EDC program.
innonate
· 3 months ago
I think we could go wrong focusing on hackers with new programs in NYC. We have a vibrant hacking scene -- both hardware and software -- and I think there's enough hacker-friendly money laying around.
I'm interested in the non-hackers, personally. There are a lot of brilliant minds who think like hackers but need some education on how to properly get a tech startup off the ground. That's what we have a surplus of here -- and that's the community which is underserved.
aweissman
· 3 months ago
Why do you assume the pace startups here is not accelerating? I think it is indeed, for a number of factors, one being that there are a number of seed and early stage funding sources around to support it.
innonate
· 3 months ago
I definitely think the pace of startups is accelerating here, and I think hackers have great resources already. I still think we're leaving major innovators out of the picture -- some non-hackers especially -- and could find creative ways to bring them into the fold, and out of the brain-and-soul-sucking industries which dominate NYC.
Perhaps its my own personal experience, but I think there's a right path for training non-developers to make big contributions to the tech startup world. I also think that if we did this in a coordinated fashion, the effects would be transformational.
jaredhecht
· 3 months ago
Nate, as someone relatively new to this world, I'm curious to hear what you think qualifies the "right path for training non-developers." I'd like to think that there is still plenty of room within tech startups for people who are equally entrepreneurial and analytical as hackers, but lack the programming chops. I feel like a lot of discussion lately has been focused around the idea that if you're not a programmer or you didn't graduate with a CS degree, then you're not fit for a startup. It would be nice to hear the other side of this debate. I think it's equally valuable.
innonate
· 3 months ago
Jared, go make yourself so intensely aware and understanding of how software engineering works that an untrained eye can't tell a difference and CTOs talk to you like you are one of them. Live the products and understand why some succeed and some fail. Eat web apps for breakfast, and -- before lunch -- learn to install and hack-around on Drupal, Wordpress, and even get up and running on Ruby on Rails.
At the end of the day, you'll still be a non-programmer. But, you won't be an idiot like so many other non-programmers (the reason folks say you must be a programmer to succeed).
That's the basic program I think is needed.
jaredhecht
· 3 months ago
I agree that understanding programming (jargon and the whole works) is a necessity. It seems like that can be picked up in a basic CS101 book, reading the right blogs, and experiencing it firsthand. I luckily sit next to two very talented programmers who are more than willing to teach me about the different languages/uses/etc.
You began to address the primary dilemma before: "Building a program which effectively identifies the best and brightest locked away in these industries, and providing the resources to turn their disruptive ideas into disruptive startups, is a big answer for me."
I'm still not entirely convinced that learning code is the finite answer here. If I'm 2-3 years out of college working at the Goldman Sachs and McKinsey's of the world and suddenly get the entrepreneurial itch, I can't drop everything to learn to code. And even if I do, my code will never be as good or robust as that of a talented programmer who has been at it for years. Like you said, immersing oneself, eating and breathing engineering is a great way to start; however, I think there's a lot more to it.
If the value-added of this particular demographic is not concentrated in product development, then where is it focused? How can you take the best and the brightest from the "Titan Industries" and focus their skill sets towards transforming the way startups grow? Chris Dixon also had an interesting post on this yesterday, but I'm still curious as to how and where this group fits in. I don't think there's one right answer, but it's a question worth exploring in order to better understand how to leverage NYC's competitive advantage in this area.
innonate
· 3 months ago
I'm not saying learn code. I'm saying learn "the ways of" code -- and that's nowhere to be found in a CS101 book. It's to be found on Andrew Kortina's blog or at a Justin Day's BarCamp session on 3d, self-replicating robots. The idea is -- if you not already a programmer -- to think like a programmer. The people who say you have to be a programmer are wrong, but I don't care what role you want to end up filling at a startup -- founder, CEO, maid, biz dev, product, QA, etc -- the people who saw you have to think like a programmer are right. You'll end up wasting a lot of cycles if you don't learn to do that. And unless you're insanely good (and experienced) at what you do, those wasted cycles are just too much waste for a startup to need your services, no matter how smart.
jedc
· 2 months ago
Hi, Nate. It's great to see some discussion leading from my paper. (And I'm glad the data I compiled is useful.)
I've been thinking and chatting about similar issues with people in Cambridge. (UK, that is.) While it's much, much smaller than NYC, Cambridge has a truly remarkable concentration in hard tech/science/health. People there are just trying to deal with some of the UK cultural issues as well as breaking down silos that have been established over the years.
Earlier this summer I started the Cambridge Tech Meetup, taking a lot of inspiration from the New York Tech Meetup. It's been an interesting experience; would love to chat sometime about how NYTM is run.
All Comments
I think the benefits to creating a vibrant startup community in NYC (like the one growing in DUMBO) are far reaching. To paraphrase Paul Graham, hackers will go where other hackers go. So creating a magnet for brilliant young talent is a great way to manufacture luck, which is the point of any incubator and EDC program.
I'm interested in the non-hackers, personally. There are a lot of brilliant minds who think like hackers but need some education on how to properly get a tech startup off the ground. That's what we have a surplus of here -- and that's the community which is underserved.
Perhaps its my own personal experience, but I think there's a right path for training non-developers to make big contributions to the tech startup world. I also think that if we did this in a coordinated fashion, the effects would be transformational.
At the end of the day, you'll still be a non-programmer. But, you won't be an idiot like so many other non-programmers (the reason folks say you must be a programmer to succeed).
That's the basic program I think is needed.
You began to address the primary dilemma before:
"Building a program which effectively identifies the best and brightest locked away in these industries, and providing the resources to turn their disruptive ideas into disruptive startups, is a big answer for me."
I'm still not entirely convinced that learning code is the finite answer here. If I'm 2-3 years out of college working at the Goldman Sachs and McKinsey's of the world and suddenly get the entrepreneurial itch, I can't drop everything to learn to code. And even if I do, my code will never be as good or robust as that of a talented programmer who has been at it for years. Like you said, immersing oneself, eating and breathing engineering is a great way to start; however, I think there's a lot more to it.
If the value-added of this particular demographic is not concentrated in product development, then where is it focused? How can you take the best and the brightest from the "Titan Industries" and focus their skill sets towards transforming the way startups grow? Chris Dixon also had an interesting post on this yesterday, but I'm still curious as to how and where this group fits in. I don't think there's one right answer, but it's a question worth exploring in order to better understand how to leverage NYC's competitive advantage in this area.
nowhere to be found in a CS101 book. It's to be found on Andrew Kortina's
blog or at a Justin Day's BarCamp session on 3d, self-replicating robots.
The idea is -- if you not already a programmer -- to think like a
programmer. The people who say you have to be a programmer are wrong, but I
don't care what role you want to end up filling at a startup -- founder,
CEO, maid, biz dev, product, QA, etc -- the people who saw you have to think
like a programmer are right. You'll end up wasting a lot of cycles if you
don't learn to do that. And unless you're insanely good (and experienced) at
what you do, those wasted cycles are just too much waste for a startup to
need your services, no matter how smart.
I've been thinking and chatting about similar issues with people in Cambridge. (UK, that is.) While it's much, much smaller than NYC, Cambridge has a truly remarkable concentration in hard tech/science/health. People there are just trying to deal with some of the UK cultural issues as well as breaking down silos that have been established over the years.
Earlier this summer I started the Cambridge Tech Meetup, taking a lot of inspiration from the New York Tech Meetup. It's been an interesting experience; would love to chat sometime about how NYTM is run.